ITPython

OA renders my second XP boot useless

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OA Premium Version 5.0.0.1097

Windows XP 32-bit SP3

Other Security: GDATA anti-virus, Sandboxie.

I dual boot XP on my computer, right now I am on my main XP boot because OA completely messed up (or shall I say, messes with) my second XP boot. I was using OA version 4.0.0.45 on that boot and it worked flawlessly, however since my license is expiring in about a month I decided I should upgrade to the latest OA. I have already upgraded to the latest version on my main boot (the one I am using now), and so far I think it's working well and has some great features that OA version 4.0.0.45 did not have.

Here is the problem. I installed the latest OA in the form of an upgrade (how I usually upgrade my OA), installation went fine and restarted my computer as prompted by OA. Now when I logged back in none of my regular start-up processes started up, my AV, Sandboxie, taskmanager... nothing started up like it normally would. All that started was OA, and it proceeded with it's learning mode procedure. So I figure maybe the learning mode had something to do with this, so after it finished with learning mode I restarted the computer again. And just like before when I logged in the only thing that started was OA.

I can access OA just fine, and going through the history events it does not show OA as blocking anything. But here is the real catch, I cannot open ANYTHING on my computer when OA is running. If I try to start a program (like Firefox)... nothing. Notepad... nothing. msconfig... nothing. Install/uninstall programs...nothing. Services... nothing. regedit... nothing. I can maneuver through windows explorer, manually launch the task manager and I can still access the control panel... I just can't use any of the programs in it. If I close and shutdown OA, within a few seconds I can access everything like normal.

Thinking perhaps this was due to a botched install I decided to try again. This time with a fresh install instead of an upgrade. So I proceed through the installation, enter my license key, go through the safety check and restarted my computer. Once again same deal as before, only thing that started was OA. This time I decide to uninstall OA manually before installing. So after shutting down OA, so I could access the install/uninstall programs list, I uninstall OA completely and again go through the installation procedure. But again this did not make any difference, once I got it all installed again the same problem came up.

Now I am getting really frustrated so I decided to use Revo uninstaller to completely get rid of any leftover traces of OA after a uninstall. After getting rid of registry files and other misc stuff left behind I do another install.... once again it did not help. Every single time I encounter the same problem. I even tried to go back to version 4.0.0.45 but that version had a flaw that gives me some kind of 10054 socket error when it tries to register the key, so I can't even get it started after a install. So going back to my old version is now a impossibility. But the new version renders my second XP boot completely worthless unless I completely shut down OA.

I have absolutely no idea why it is doing this, usually I am pretty good at troubleshooting and resolving these kinds of problems, but something with the new OA just does NOT want to cooperate with my second XP boot. Any kinds of logs or debug info I can supply I will, just direct me how to obtain these things properly and who I need to send the info to, because this is a MAJOR problem as I cannot use my second XP boot until this gets resolved.

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To get the debug logs select Options from the left hand side of the GUI. Under the General tab tick 'enable debug mode'. Make sure everything is ticked and then reboot.

Try to open a couple of things eg Firefox etc so the debugger sees what you are doing. Then untick debug mode and go to where your OA program folder is, open it and find the folder called logs. I usually just copy the folder, and then zip it.

Send it (along with a link to this thread and OA logs as title) to

[email protected]

By the way the only thing you didn't mention in your well written post was which other security software you use.

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I did mention my security software at the top of the thread next to what version of windows I have and what version OA I am using.

But thanks for the reply stapp, I will log back into my second XP boot and gather up the logs to email. Will they reply back or am I just to assume the problem will be eventually worked out in some future update? Because I need to get my second boot up and running soon with a properly working OA.

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Sorry I missed your av bit :blush:

Sometimes they may communicate with you either via pm or here on forum.

Thanks for taking the trouble to report this and allowing the devs a chance to see if something is wrong via some logs.

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Alright, I got the logs sent off. I tried to start various programs and actually managed to get a few things going, like Internet Explore and my forced Firefox sandbox. Although my default firefox sandbox still would not start up.

Another interesting thing to note is that when I added GDATA to the exclusions list and restarted my computer, the GDATA tray icon showed up and I was able to start it up. And also note that several of my normal programs (like GDATA, Sandboxie and their related processes) are all present in the process list of task manager, but I just cannot start them up into a GUI.

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Well I have managed to temporarily fix the problem, and by that I mean I was able to get 4.0.0.45 back up and running. Originally when I tried to install 4.0.0.45 I would get the infamous "10054 Socket error" which would prevent me from registering my key and thus making it so OA would not run. However I found that if I installed V5, registered my key, then do an "upgrade" install to 4.0.0.45, I was able to bypass the key authoring system since my key was already authorized from the V5 install. I'm just glad there was a upgrade option when going from a higher version to a lower one, otherwise my second XP boot would have been completely useless until somebody at OA fixed the problem.

On that note I haven't heard back from anybody at OA and obviously nobody has responded here, which is disappointing. If I did not have a working XP boot and was unable to use my computer, I would be incredibly ticked off at the lack of help from the OA team on this, as it has been a few days since I reported this. I don't know about the rest of you, but even a day without my computer is far too long. I'm just lucky I have two XP boots and that one of them was working properly.

I will keep checking this topic and/or waiting for a email from the OA team, because my premium subscription is ending soon, and I want to upgrade to the latest version of OA before I cannot upgrade anymore.

BTW to any OA/Emsisoft staff reading this, I realize the email I used for this forum account and the email I used to send the OA logs does not match my email from when I purchased OA, but don't think I am lying about owning a subscription because you cannot find my email associated with any purchases. I use email aliases to help protect my identify on the net, so if you want to know my true email that is linked to my original OA purchase, let me know by PM or by simply responding to my OA log email. I am a active subscriber and I hope I am not shrugged off as some kind of freeloader expecting priority customer service, as I am a paying customer and have been for several years. I might consider re-doing my subscription, however if the service is lacking I really wouldn't want to pay for that now would I?

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Hi ITPython,

Could you please gather some logs from both boots and send them to oasupport (at) emsisoft (dot) com ?

Please include the link to this forum topic in your email.

Please also state the relevance of the logs to your OS boots. (e.g. logs1.zip - 1st system installation, logs2.zip - 2nd system installation).

Thanks in advance,

Best regards,

Andrey.

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Hi ITPython,

Could you please gather some logs from both boots and send them to oasupport (at) emsisoft (dot) com ?

Please include the link to this forum topic in your email.

Please also state the relevance of the logs to your OS boots. (e.g. logs1.zip - 1st system installation, logs2.zip - 2nd system installation).

Thanks in advance,

Best regards,

Andrey.

Andrew,

Thanks for the reply. What exactly do you want me to do with the logs on my main XP boot? (which has no problems whatsoever with OA V5). Do you just want me to turn on a logging, do a little bit of normal computer stuff then send the logs to you?

Cause I already sent you guys logs from my second XP boot in which the problems occur at. And as stated above, I managed to get 4.0.0.45 installed and working on my second boot and would rather not go back to the broken V5 until some solution is made. If you need extra logs from a V5 installation on my second boot I will do it, but please find the logs I already sent you and then let me know what else you need.

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Andrew,

Thanks for the reply. What exactly do you want me to do with the logs on my main XP boot? (which has no problems whatsoever with OA V5). Do you just want me to turn on a logging, do a little bit of normal computer stuff then send the logs to you?

Cause I already sent you guys logs from my second XP boot in which the problems occur at. And as stated above, I managed to get 4.0.0.45 installed and working on my second boot and would rather not go back to the broken V5 until some solution is made. If you need extra logs from a V5 installation on my second boot I will do it, but please find the logs I already sent you and then let me know what else you need.

Ok) Anyhow - please collect some logs from the first boot and send them to the address in my previous post ;)

Please make sure that the logs include the boot time (in other words - reboot after turning logging on and collect the logs after reboot ;))

Thanks in advance,

Best regards,

Andrey.

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Hi ITpython,

A recap of what I got from your various posts:

You dual boot two copies of XP.

Both copies of XP had OA V4.0.0.45 installed.

Both were activated with a licence key(s) about to expire.

You didn't describe the licence(s):

Do you have one paid licence covering up to 2 PCs or

Do you have two paid licences, each for one PC, with possibly different expiry dates? or

Do you have one paid and a second from a 'free' promo.

You have OA V 5 working properly in the first XP boot.

*** was this done as an Upgrade or install or an uninstall/reinstall? If an Install, did you Import config from V 4?

You Upgraded the second XP boot to OA v 5 which appeared to be successfull but you had problems running things.

***There's a good chance that there are significant differences in the configuration files and the correct process would be to uninstall v 4 and reboot twice followed by installation of V 5.

*** Do you have the same 'other' software in the second XP boot as in the first XP boot?

You did an Install in the second XP boot without uninstalling V 4 (as above), entering a licence in the process.

*** Without performing an unistall to free up the key it will look as though you're installing on another PC. You'd need to log in to your User Area and Reset your licence.

This may have left this without a valid licence available, important in the next step.

You did an uninstall followed by an install in the second XP boot.

*** Did you reboot twice after the uninstall, prior to the install?

If you uninstall OA without a valid key (above step), the licence database is not reset and may show the licence used for the second XP boot as 'in use' which means you have to reset it in your User Area.

Then, in a later post, you said that you 'Registered' your V 5 key, sounds like a new key. Is it for 1 or 2 PCs?

However I found that if I installed V5 (*** which licence?), registered my key, then do an "upgrade" install to 4.0.0.45, I was able to bypass the key authoring system since my key was already authorized from the V5 install.

This indicates that the licence(s) used previously were 'old' V 4 licences. Is this true?

*** Upgrading to an older version can be just as bad as Upgrading to a newer version. Once you had V 5 installed in the second XP boot.

*** the first XP boot may use the 'old' key, the second XP boot may use the 'new' key.

It's pretty hard to really understand the sequence of the steps and the licences used or in use at each step.

Overall, you need to check your User Area, possibly reset your licence(s).

You may need to open the OA UI in the first XP boot and on the Licence page, enter the new licence if it's using the 'old' licence which is about to expire. You can tell by the number of days left.

You probably need to uninstall OA in the second XP boot, reboot twice and install OA v 5 using the new licence and either 'Trust all' or the 'Wizard' option but definitely NOT 'Import'.

It's much easier for us to help if you document step-by-step: which XP boot?, which licence applies? and so on...

Good luck.

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Ok) Anyhow - please collect some logs from the first boot and send them to the address in my previous post ;)

Please make sure that the logs include the boot time (in other words - reboot after turning logging on and collect the logs after reboot ;))

Thanks in advance,

Best regards,

Andrey.

Ok, I started logging on my main XP boot (which has no problem with V5), restarted, then sent the logs to the email address above with a link to this thread. Sorry for taking a while to respond, I wasn't expecting a reply so soon.

Hi ITpython,

A recap of what I got from your various posts:

You dual boot two copies of XP.

Both copies of XP had OA V4.0.0.45 installed.

No, only my second XP boot started with v4.0.0.45, my main XP boot got upgraded to OA V5 from OA v4.5

Both were activated with a licence key(s) about to expire.

You didn't describe the licence(s):

Do you have one paid licence covering up to 2 PCs or

Do you have two paid licences, each for one PC, with possibly different expiry dates? or

Do you have one paid and a second from a 'free' promo.

Irrelevant IMO, but I believe I have a 3-PC single license OA subscription. I use the same license key with both OA's.

You have OA V 5 working properly in the first XP boot.

*** was this done as an Upgrade or install or an uninstall/reinstall? If an Install, did you Import config from V 4?

On my main boot I did a upgrade install to V5. Never imported.

--- Continued on next post due to quote limitations ---

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--- Continued ---

You Upgraded the second XP boot to OA v 5 which appeared to be successfull but you had problems running things.

***There's a good chance that there are significant differences in the configuration files and the correct process would be to uninstall v 4 and reboot twice followed by installation of V 5.

I never thought about rebooting twice after a uninstall, I only rebooted when the installation/uninstall told me to do so. However in one of my attempts to figure out the problem, I used Revo uninstaller to completely get rid of anything OA related (registry stuff too). And even then a fresh install did not work. So even with the lack of config files altogether, the problem still occurred.

*** Do you have the same 'other' software in the second XP boot as in the first XP boot?

Everything is the same (security software wise) except my AV. On my main boot I am using Avira Premium, whereas on my second boot I am using GDATA.

You did an Install in the second XP boot without uninstalling V 4 (as above), entering a licence in the process.

*** Without performing an unistall to free up the key it will look as though you're installing on another PC. You'd need to log in to your User Area and Reset your licence.

This may have left this without a valid licence available, important in the next step.

I have yet to have any license problems, as I am always able to register the license with V5 just fine. It is V4.0.0.45 that has this notorious socket error problem, but this is due to the older version of OA. Because even if I can't register the key with v4 (due to the 10054 socket error) I can uninstall v4 then register the key with v5 during its installation.

You did an uninstall followed by an install in the second XP boot.

*** Did you reboot twice after the uninstall, prior to the install?

If you uninstall OA without a valid key (above step), the licence database is not reset and may show the licence used for the second XP boot as 'in use' which means you have to reset it in your User Area.

As mentioned above, the license key is not the problem.

Then, in a later post, you said that you 'Registered' your V 5 key, sounds like a new key. Is it for 1 or 2 PCs?

The amount of times I re-registered my key I would have had to buy a 200-PC license if each one was considered "a new key".

This indicates that the licence(s) used previously were 'old' V 4 licences. Is this true?

Not sure what you are getting at here, the license key I have used is the same across my entire PC regardless of what version I am using.

*** Upgrading to an older version can be just as bad as Upgrading to a newer version. Once you had V 5 installed in the second XP boot.

Well it's the only way I can actually get 4.0.0.45 activated with my key, otherwise I just get the socket error problem and can't ever use my old OA version. So far I haven't encountered any stability problems or bugs with 4.0.0.45 when I did the upgrade from v5.

*** the first XP boot may use the 'old' key, the second XP boot may use the 'new' key.

It's pretty hard to really understand the sequence of the steps and the licences used or in use at each step.

Overall, you need to check your User Area, possibly reset your licence(s).

You may need to open the OA UI in the first XP boot and on the Licence page, enter the new licence if it's using the 'old' licence which is about to expire. You can tell by the number of days left.

You probably need to uninstall OA in the second XP boot, reboot twice and install OA v 5 using the new licence and either 'Trust all' or the 'Wizard' option but definitely NOT 'Import'.

Unless using an old key renders my computer useless as described in my situation, I don't know why you are even bringing up the license key as a topic. It is a moot point and irrelevant to my main problem.

It's much easier for us to help if you document step-by-step: which XP boot?, which licence applies? and so on...

Good luck.

If I knew that there was going to be so many problems with v5 on my second boot I would have tried to document every step I took, but as it stands trying to re-write everything I did is like trying to describe a car accident after it is over. I spent hours upon hours troubleshooting, trying every technique and solution I knew, so I hope you can understand that since I do not have a photographic memory I cannot describe every single step I took.

Either way I described the situation perfectly fine in the OP and proceeding posts, as most of the follow-up questions you asked above were completely irrelevant to the actual problem.

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Hi ITPython,

Thanks for the logs,

Just a crazy thought - when you tried installing OA on your second XP boot - where did you install it to? The default folder you were proposed to install, right? If so - I would like to ask you to uninstall the OA v4 from that boot (important: using OA's uninstaller, not revo uninstaller or any other tool), perform 2 reboots and perform a clean install OA v5. An important thing: please specify some different folder to the one you'd be proposed to install to. (For example - disk:\Program Files\Online Armor Boot 2\).

Thanks in advance,

Best regards,

Andrey.

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Aside from rebooting twice after a uninstall, I already tried that in one of my many efforts to troubleshoot the problem. In the past I remember that helping with one of my older OA versions, installing to a different folder. But it did no good when I tried that with V5.

Now I could try the double reboot + using a new folder, but it seems the biggest chance for success would have been installing into another folder. But if a double reboot really makes a huge difference I can uninstall my currently working 4.0.0.45 to give it a try.

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Aside from rebooting twice after a uninstall, I already tried that in one of my many efforts to troubleshoot the problem. In the past I remember that helping with one of my older OA versions, installing to a different folder. But it did no good when I tried that with V5.

Now I could try the double reboot + using a new folder, but it seems the biggest chance for success would have been installing into another folder. But if a double reboot really makes a huge difference I can uninstall my currently working 4.0.0.45 to give it a try.

Look, when you install OA on two different systems into the same folder you can face all kinds of errors, etc. Please try installing OA into a different folder on your second "boot".

Rebooting twice needed to make sure that the OS has deleted the drivers. (they're being only disabled on the first reboot).

Best regards,

Andrey.

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Look, when you install OA on two different systems into the same folder you can face all kinds of errors, etc. Please try installing OA into a different folder on your second "boot".

What if I have to different hard disk drives, both with the same OS and security software installed? Can I install OA in the default folder on both systems (C:\Program Files\Online Armor)?

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Not sure what you are getting at here, the license key I have used is the same across my entire PC regardless of what version I am using.

OK, I'm now a believer that the licence isn't the issue. Sorry for pressing that so hard.

If I knew that there was going to be so many problems with v5 on my second boot I would have tried to document every step I took, but as it stands trying to re-write everything I did is like trying to describe a car accident after it is over. I spent hours upon hours troubleshooting, trying every technique and solution I knew, so I hope you can understand that since I do not have a photographic memory I cannot describe every single step I took.

A very good analogy!

Either way I described the situation perfectly fine in the OP and proceeding posts, as most of the follow-up questions you asked above were completely irrelevant to the actual problem.

I offer my apologies and hope you accept. You were gracious to answer them politely, I appreciate that.

I'll refrain from any more intrusions and hope that Andrey can get your problem resolved,

Jim C

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Look, when you install OA on two different systems into the same folder you can face all kinds of errors, etc. Please try installing OA into a different folder on your second "boot".

Rebooting twice needed to make sure that the OS has deleted the drivers. (they're being only disabled on the first reboot).

Best regards,

Andrey.

You seem to be confused as to how dual-booting OS's works. Both my XP boots are completely independent of each other, and I am NOT installing OA in the same folder as the OA on my main boot. My SSD is partitioned, and each XP boot installs programs and performs operations separately from each other, and each XP partition have their own drive letters as well.

You also seem to have trouble reading my replies, because I stated in my last post that I already tried installing into another folder which did NOT work. In the future if you could actually read my post before replying, that would be greatly appreciated. Because arrogance and customer service do not go well together.

However, for the sake of further troubleshooting I will try the whole process over again, except this time reboot twice after the uninstall. I will report back with my findings.

BTW I was talking to my brother today, who I have always recommended OA to, and he also had a ton of problems installing V5 on his computer. Very similar to the problems I am having, only his problems were much worse. They were similar in the fact that OA was the only thing that worked, while the rest of the computer was inaccessible while OA was running. So something is seriously wrong with V5, and I hope we can get to the bottom of this.

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You seem to be confused as to how dual-booting OS's works. Both my XP boots are completely independent of each other, and I am NOT installing OA in the same folder as the OA on my main boot. My SSD is partitioned, and each XP boot installs programs and performs operations separately from each other, and each XP partition have their own drive letters as well.

You also seem to have trouble reading my replies, because I stated in my last post that I already tried installing into another folder which did NOT work. In the future if you could actually read my post before replying, that would be greatly appreciated. Because arrogance and customer service do not go well together.

However, for the sake of further troubleshooting I will try the whole process over again, except this time reboot twice after the uninstall. I will report back with my findings.

BTW I was talking to my brother today, who I have always recommended OA to, and he also had a ton of problems installing V5 on his computer. Very similar to the problems I am having, only his problems were much worse. They were similar in the fact that OA was the only thing that worked, while the rest of the computer was inaccessible while OA was running. So something is seriously wrong with V5, and I hope we can get to the bottom of this.

You should not worry ;) I didn't have troubles reading or understanding either your posts or the idea of "dual boot" ;)

Best regards,

Andrey.

P.S.

It would be good to check if the oahlp.exe process is running on your second boot as well.

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Ok,I got some downtime to relay some more troubleshooting info. Mostly bad news, but some potentially good news as well.

Andrey, you wanted me to try rebooting twice after a uninstall, so that is what I decided to do, this time I penciled down the steps so I could remember exactly what I did and in what order.

1. Uninstalled V4.0.0.45 which was currently working fine. Rebooted twice after uninstalling.

2. Began V5 (1097 build) install.

3. Entered license key

4. Installed into a new folder

5. Install complete. Began safety check wizard

6. For less potential issues, I chose the option "Trust everything on this computer"

7. After safety check ran and when prompted to change/customize OA settings, I did not change any settings.

8. OA prompts me to restart computer.

9. Restart computer, OA starts up in learning mode. Same issues as before, nothing loads except for OA.

10. After learning mode finished, I figured I could reboot twice just for the heck of it.

11. After rebooting twice the problem was still occurring. No changes.

12. Now I decide to troubleshoot further.

13. I close and shutdown OA from the tray with the right-click context menu.

14. I go into my start menu and click on OA. Nothing happens and a minuet or so later I get an error saying OA could not be started.

15. After the failed start I proceed to my services to manually start OA and OAhelper

16. After starting both services (which were on automatic) I once again went to my start menu and started OA.

17. This time OA started.

18. After this I noticed that OA was now allowing me to use my computer normally, meaning I could start/run programs, just like normal.

19. I decided to try my luck and reboot, hoping these new changes would carry on with the next reboot.

20. To my surprise after the reboot, my programs and everything else started up like normal. I was very happy!

21. Now that it seemed everything was working properly I decided to customize the OA settings how I normally like them. IE running certain programs as run safer, blocking certain programs from accessing the net etc etc.

22. After setting the OA settings just how I like them, I decided to to see if it would work after another reboot.

23. After rebooting everything started as normal, and everything seemed normal. Very good!

24. I go back into the OA settings to see if everything was still working properly. This is when I saw the first problem. My firewall rules had been reset. I had set lsass.exe and System to be blocked from internet access (red), but after the restart they were no longer blocked but in fact allowed (green.)

25. Wondering what the deal was I tried blocking them again and rebooted to see if the rules would stick. After the reboot they had reset once again. I had them blocked, and they were no longer blocked after the restart. The only blocks that stayed were the RAW and ICMP blocks, but the entire program was still allowed. Note that the programs that had a OA pop-up prompt, stayed blocked. But my manual lsass.exe and System blocks did not stick.

26. After noticing this issue I started to think there was a major bug going on, and that is when I noticed that my Web Shield had been turned off, and I could not turn it on. I had sort of noticed it was disabled back on step 18, but I ignored it since I figured it would reset back to normal after a reboot.

So after all that I got fed up with V5 and tried to install V4.0.0.45 using the upgrade method I had used previously in order to get my license onto 4.0.0.45 (which avoided the 10054 issue). However there was no upgrade option... and after 4 more hours of installing/uninstalling/troubleshooting I finally managed to get the option to upgrade from v5 to v4.0.0.45, and that is where I stand right now.

So there you have it, another adventure of stress and frustration with V5. I can say right now, unless there is a sure fire fix for this, I am NOT going to troubleshoot v5 anymore, because I was extremely lucky to get 4.0.0.45 back working again. And I do not want to go through that again.

Hopefully this new info helps somebody, because this is one heck of a problem. And yes Andrey, OAhelper was running with V5.

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Hi ITPython,

Thanks for such a detailed description :)

Could you please pm me the system information file (.nfo) from your second xp boot?

Thanks in advance,

Best regards,

Andrey.

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